Hill-Lewis: DA must grow, reform and win black voter trust

You can also listen to this podcast on iono.fm here.

JEREMY MAGGS: Geordin Hill-Lewis takes over the Democratic Alliance (DA), I think at a pivotal moment, he says he wants to grow the party beyond its traditional base, close to what he calls a trust deficit with black voters, stay in the government of national unity (GNU) as a principled partner, rather than a silent passenger, and build the DA into the country’s biggest party by 2029.

Listen/read:

But the big test, I think, starts now. It starts immediately. Can he broaden the DA’s appeal without losing its core? Can he steady a fragile GNU and will his first leadership moves include changes to the team that John Steenhuisen leaves behind. So there is lots to talk about.

Geordin Hill-Lewis, a very warm welcome. Let’s go in with the statements that you’ve made quite emphatically, might I say, about winning black trust. Let me put this to you, why should black voters believe you now, when many still see your party as one that does not fully understand their lived reality.

GEORDIN HILL-LEWIS: I think the key difference is that 18 months ago, we got the opportunity to have a platform in government at a national level and so people, particularly black South Africans, can see that the things they have been told and the kind of lies that they have been fed for many years about the DA, none of those things are happening.

In fact, what is happening is that our ministers are diligently going about fixing institutions that have been broken for many years, and people are seeing actually, that they derive personal and community benefit out of that.

Read:

So if over the coming years, we can continue to do that and even more so, and we can do it in more places, for example, in the City of Johannesburg, Tshwane, Ekurhuleni and elsewhere, then I think many voters can go to the polls saying, I had all these concerns, I heard all of these stories, none of those things have materialised.

In fact, all that’s happened is I’ve got to give it to them, they’ve done quite a good job in fixing things for everyone in government. I think that will break down the preconceived ideas about the DA and build trust.

JEREMY MAGGS: Is that enough, though, to turn you into the largest political party by 2029?

GEORDIN HILL-LEWIS: Well, the honest answer, Jeremy, is, I don’t know. I think we have to steadily grow, put one foot in front of the other in the right direction. It’s certainly not going to be enough to win an outright majority.

That I think is probably off the cards for the next decade or more, maybe two decades, South Africa will have coalition governments.

But it needs to at least give us a shot of being the biggest party, because then we can really start to turbocharge the rebuilding of South Africa’s institutions and getting our country working positively for everyone.

JEREMY MAGGS: The DA still opposes broad-based black economic empowerment (B-BBEE). Your challenge, I would suggest to you, is how you persuade black South Africans that you are serious about redress and opportunity and not simply opposed to a model put forward by the ANC (African National Congress).

GEORDIN HILL-LEWIS: That is exactly the challenge.

The ANC has achieved a very clever sleight of hand by saying if you oppose their model of empowerment, which is essentially crony enrichment, and in many cases, legalised corruption, if you oppose their model, then you oppose the principle of redress and empowerment altogether, and of course, that is not true, but it’s a very clever sleight of hand.

So you’ve summarised the challenge, we have to show genuinely and in an emotionally resonant way, and this is entirely the case, that we are profoundly committed to the advancement of South Africans, particularly poor South Africans, and most of whom are black South Africans.

We are deeply invested. That’s why we’re actually in politics. The whole point of politics, if you’re in it for the right reasons, is to see people lifted out of poverty and see people flourishing and development and progress.

So we are deeply invested in that, but we are not invested in this current model and I honestly think there’s a growing number of people, perhaps not a majority yet, although some polls will tell you this is the case, there’s a growing number of South Africans that say, all of these politicians who have this enormous unexplained wealth, billionaires and multi-millionaires, houses, luxurious palaces all over the place that we don’t know where they come from.

Read:

Well, this is where they come from. So obviously they’re not going to change a system that that benefits them tremendously.

But I do think there’s a growing number of people who say, actually, some major reform of this system is important, is necessary without compromising or throwing the baby out with the bathwater, that advancement, redress is absolutely necessary and we are committed to it.

JEREMY MAGGS: Let me ask you a question about the government of national unity. As you take over the leadership, do you have a red line? What would make the DA walk away from this government set up?

GEORDIN HILL-LEWIS: The problem is, as soon as you start talking about red lines, then everyone has an incentive to test them.

I’m not so sure that it is healthy to discuss our red lines, so openly.

But I think a few things are absolutely clear, we said the purpose of the GNU, first and foremost, it is to keep the destructive and chaotic alternative away from the corridors of power, away from the levers of the state.

So one red line would be the red berets. I think that’s one nice way of summarising it.

We do not want the MK (uMkhonto weSizwe) or the EFF (Economic Freedom Fighters) to have any access to state power, because they will use it to destroy South Africa and to grossly enrich and plunder public money, as they’ve done wherever they’ve had the opportunity to do so, and as they will do now in Gauteng, where they have been brought into the Gauteng government, unbelievably, in control of Gauteng’s finances.

So that is absolutely clear to us.

We have very firm policy opposition on other things like NHI (National Health Insurance) and expropriation (of land) and so on. But I think that’s probably best left to very tough negotiations and fights inside the GNU.

JEREMY MAGGS: Well, talking about tough negotiations, are you reviewing the DA ministers and top leadership immediately, and should John Steenhuisen expect to keep your full confidence?

GEORDIN HILL-LEWIS: Yes, he should. He’s involved in an epic battle at the moment with foot-and-mouth disease and he has set out a plan to try and turn the tide on that disease. We are seeing the first signs of that plan starting to work with the rollout of a wide-scale vaccination programme.

He set himself the target of vaccinating 80% of the country’s herd by December this year, and I think we have to back him in that plan and see how it goes.

But I have made it clear that no person in the DA in any position, not in my position as mayor, nor in any other position in the DA, should anyone feel entitled to that job.

They are there because we have earned the trust of the voters. The voters can remove that trust if we don’t perform.

So performance is the key metric by which I will judge anyone, not by who’s friends with who and who’s up and who’s down. That’s not my style.

I want people there who are going to perform, who are going to show the DA difference, so that every voter in the country can see, here is a new thing, here is a breath of fresh air, we can see the benefit we’re deriving from having the DA in government.

JEREMY MAGGS: Just a final question aimed at the business community, it likes stability, but it also wants reform. What do you say today to reassure business that the party under your leadership will be both pro-growth but also politically disciplined?

GEORDIN HILL-LEWIS: I would reassure them that I’m really invested in trying to make the government of national unity work. I think it is the best chance that South Africa has had in 25 years to get economic growth and to get people out of poverty.

I don’t think that there’s anyone, even inside the ANC, who supports the economic reform agenda as much as we do. We are the biggest supporters of the reform agenda.

Of course, we don’t think it’s going nearly fast enough and far enough. We want much more reform, we want more urgency, faster and harder basically is our message.

Listen: SA’s economic rebound hangs on urgent reform

But certainly the direction is right, it is just too timid. We really want to make that work for the sake of our country. We know that this is the best chance we have to to deliver a growing economy.

JEREMY MAGGS: And how on earth can you do that while not sitting in cabinet and instead occupying the position of mayor of Cape Town?

GEORDIN HILL-LEWIS: Oh, that’s actually, I think, a benefit, not a downside, because a mayor is, just to be honest with you, a mayor is a much more influential and powerful position than, I would say, 90% of most of the ministers in cabinets.

You can really get things done. You can really solve problems. Out on the campaign trail, most of the complaints you hear from the public are all local government issues.

If we get the cities working, they are the engines of growth in our country and they are what’s going to turn around the broken public services in our country.

So I love being a mayor, and that’s where I want to be.

Then secondly, I think it’s just healthy politically to give me some distance from the very different dynamic around the cabinet table so that I can speak freely and speak my mind and agree when necessary and disagree volubly when necessary.

JEREMY MAGGS: Geordin Hill-Lewis, thank you very much indeed.